Topic: Budget LED downlights

Budget LED downlights 

As I have posted on here before about various light fittings I thought I would add this info about some cheap LED downlights I just ordered from ebay.

The compact fluorescent downlights I got in from the UK were fine but too slow to warm up for busy rooms (full brightness takes about a minute). So I used those for the bedroom level and sought another solution for downstairs (living/dining/kitchen/laundry).

GU10 style downlights with a LED bulb seemed a good eco/low power solution, they look modern and small but were pricey. Supplier pointed out also that they would need to be fitted with heatcans and suitably cut around insulation just in case a future owner replaced the LED (low temp) bulb with a standard halogen (high temp). Annoying. It was then I discovered LED fittings, where the bulb and the fitting are made as one to save cost. The long lifespan of LED makes this possible. Apparently these are the Next Big Thing.

Although not commn yet these are available from NZ suppliers but as I needed 25 I was not willing to pay $110 EACH (!). How are they charging that I wonder, as that is more than the cost of a separate fitting and LED bulb? And this style of construction should be saving money? Just because they are new to the market?

Anyway, a bit of Googling later I found some cheap (CE approved) direct from China equivalents on Ebay Australia. Total with shipping is NZ$12 (twelve) each. Massive saving, of course I expect them to be lower quality but as long as they look ok and do the job then they will suffice. I intend to wire them up and run them for a couple of days before installing into the ceiling to ensure they work ok, don't get hot etc.

It seems LED fittings such as these can vary greatly in output (lumens) and how wide the beam of light they give out. So if anyone else is tempted then do carefully compare the specs on each LED light. The ones I chose are 7w, 700 lumens with only a 30 degree angle of spread. A wider spread of light may have been preferable but as I preferred the look of these bulbs and the supplier I hope they will do the job. Picture attached. Will post again here when they are installed with results.

If they work ok then this style of light should be a no-brainer replacement for all the millions of halogen downlights out there. LEDs are massively more efficient than standard halogen and at these sort of prices there is no reason to not change.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

7 watts for 700 lumens is fantastic. Will be interested in your report back.
There are new standards for down-lights , Have you looked into them?
Thanks for the update.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

I would like to know more about changing to LED too and was considering trying some of the ones selling new on TradeMe.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

I saw there was new labeling coming in, did not know about other new regs. These are CE marked so should be ok, I am sure the sparky will tell me if not :)

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Check this out on a sparkie forum , and see if you can follow it! http://www.electricalforum.co.nz/index.php?action=more_details&id=1327370300

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Well if the electricians can't understand them...!

These are to go in a new dropped ceiling over the living area. 80mm over the top of the lights is (existing) 50mm of poly insulation. I will check with the sparky, and test the lights, but I expect these led fittings will sit quite happily in that space without getting hot. As no insulation abutting or covering all should be well?

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Nick, very keen to hear how you get on with these lights. We are in exactly the same position, just completing a house reno, no desire to puncture the insulation envelope, and also need a slim fitting light for between floors. Regards
Glenn

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Hi Glenn. No problem, I will post more info here when they arrive and tested them etc.

There is always a risk with this type of stuff that it turns out to be crap of course, but given the cost saving I thought it worth a go. I was all set to order other LED lights - which look identical but were more than double the cost - via Ebay Au when I decided to have one more hunt around it and found these. So either the others were overpriced, or these are for the skip :)

Will post a few extra pictures too when they turn up. The vendor seemed professional at least, they shipped them the next day.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Hi Nick
What is the name of this LED if you dont mind me asking?

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Do you mean brand name? If so then these are not branded at all, which is quite common with a lot of the cheaper stuff.

The lights arrived today, which is pretty quick (ordered Sunday, arrived following Friday via Fedex). They look ok on first glance, a little bigger than I hoped, but will try and get them fired up and tested this weekend. If I decide not to keep them - I was hoping for a small light - then they will go on Trademe.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Lights so far seem fine. Build quality is good, not perfect. They are tilt lights and in a few the tilt screws have been fitted maybe 0.5mm off centre, so the light does not sit perfectly flat. This is a pretty minor quibble and you can't see this unless you look very closely and certainly not when the light is up. I mention only for completeness.

They came in unbranded boxes with no instructions, each light+driver. I bought 25 and although the light fittings are identical the drivers used are two types. When fitting I noticed that the drivers are fractionally different in the time it takes to start the light, maybe .25 of a second. So nothing of concern, but for look I have grouped lights with the same driver together.

As shown in the pic I ran each light for 12 hours before using. After all this time they are just warm, low enough temp to grip firmly. No worries about combustion and much less energy wasted in heat :)

I was concerned about the light spread at the stated 30 degrees but now I have a few up (in 2.4m ceiling) they look fine. There is no spotlight type effect and the light is instant, clean & bright (warm white). The lights certainly give me the modern LED light look I wanted. In the rest of the house (higher ceilings) that will be even better.

So for me these were a good cheap solution. The price with delivery for 25 was $288 ($11.52 each) and they came in a week. If anyone is interested the vendor name on Ebay Australia was delhanway2009. They have nearly 80,000 feedbacks with a 99.2% positive rating so I was happy to give them a go. Similar auction ref is 300599187692. Another type with a frosted cover (that I did not get) was 300651715426.

Of course one would need to see how these lights run long term before saying how much of a bargain they were. If they all die in six months then it will be a waste of time. But given some LED downlights are sold here for $120 each then I thought them worth a go.

Also with this kind of cheap and cheerful item who can really say if the output rating and lumens values are accurate? I put 7 (as planned) into a kitchen area 4.5 x 2.5 and that was sufficient. Of course if we need a few more then at $12 each that won't break the bank.

Last thing - it took me a good hour or two to find these on Ebay Au. There are thousands of different types and powers of LED lights on there and in different departments too. So its worth hunting for a bit. The prices for what look like identical lights can vary hugely. Even the same vendors list the same products with different prices. Some lights don't include the driver part, watch out for that.

Hope this helps, remember LEDs are very eco (at point of use anyway). Cheers Nick

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Another photo, the Ecobob server hamster fell out of his wheel when I tried to add more than one :)

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Last photo.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Cheers for the pics. They look like a good alternative to the expensive LEDs available here.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Nick, What a great update, thank you. Couple of questions if that's OK? Any issues from your electrician, given how you sourced the lights? Electrician happy with insulation laid over the top? And - what was the cutout size in your ceiling? I'm pretty excited by this development . Thanks and Regards, Glenn

Re: Budget LED downlights 

My electrician is pretty good, as in I bought them so I take responsibility for them. I'm fitting them today actually, so his input will be limited.

Generally I find with trades that they will always want you to buy best quality - because they never want to have to come back and do a job over again. That is an easy decision of course when you are not the one paying for the fittings :) If these ones turn out to be rubbish in a few months - and given how simple they are I think that is unlikely - it will be an easy matter to swap them out for different ones.

They don't have the new labels that say insulation can be laid over the top, but I don't think they have started yet. Given how cool they run it would not be an issue. As the ceiling is between floors I am not going to insulate anyway, well, not directly over the lights (there is polystyrene stapled to the ceiling, the lights will sit 100mm under that).

Cutout size - I used an 89mm, that seemed fine.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Some extra info about the official conformity of these lights. I discussed with the sparky and for him to have anything to do with them he needs to see a 'Declaration of Conformity' from the supplier, to say that the lights conform to AU/NZ regs. I have emailed the Ebay seller and asked for this but who knows what they will get back. Being European the CE mark is good enough for me.

Anyway, if I can't get this info then the sparky is not allowed to touch them as his insurance won't cover him. But I can get him to check my wiring (it was a simple swapover from old downlights anyway) when I fit them. So as always, buyer beware.

**Thought - there were some Aussie electrical shop vendors on Ebay selling the same lights, shipping them from within Oz. So maybe I will ask them for a copy of the conformity...**

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Apologies if this has been raised before but I believe
All recessed light fitting used in NZ must be marked with either IC-F, IC or CA symbols Or if no symbol then they should be marked as NON IC and shall have a warning notice attached or in the manufacturers instructions that the luminaire must not be abutted or covered with building insulation and NOT BE USED IN RESIDENTIAL INSTALLATIONS.
IC-F and IC can have insulation covered over and abutted, CA can have insulation abutted but not covered.

Nick B - I expect your electrician is feeling a bit nervous about having too much to do with your fittings if they don't comply.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Yeah, sounds fair enough NikofTime. Did find the Aussie shops on ebay selling the same thing tho, so I guess they must be approved for use there. I'll see if I can get any more info from them.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Hi Nick B, I am currently renovating and this seems to be a great solution for my lights. Did you ever find out if these lights meet NZ standards? Are they still up and running a month or so later?

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Hi there
I got a reply back from the supplier, the lights are CE approved but nothing specifically for NZ. They definitely don't have the specific supplier paperwork that the sparky wanted. No reply from the Aussie shop that was selling them either when I asked if they came with AU approval.
So the plan is to have him check the wiring and then I will fit them. They run very cool as expected and there is no insulation over them (ground floor kitchen install) so I expect them to be fine. N

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Are there any products on this site that suit?
free delivery to NZ (they can be slow though)

http://dx.com/c/flashlights-lasers-999/led-light-bulbs-907

I have bought nik naks from them, not bulbs.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Thanks Nick, I am guessing if the lights are CE approved then they are to the European standard so should be ok here.Plus the seller has sold over 90,000 products with 88% feedback so I am guessing his products work reliabily.

Magic the products look similar to the ones sold on ebay by delhanway2009 but he is half the price.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Oops too early in the morning 99% feedback was meant to say.

Re: Budget LED downlights 

Yep, if you hunt around ebay.au you will find many of these LED lights, in an identical style, all at varying prices. Mine came in plain boxes, no instructions, no manufacturer names, no info. I assume that they all come out of the same factory but could be wrong.

As always with this kind of ebay stuff it has to be buyer-beware, use them at your own risk.

Kitchen goes in today, I expect to be able to fit the lights on Thursday. If there are any problems, or if they fail in the future I will report it here.